Trump tangles with judge, complains of treatment at New York fraud trial

Can you control your client?" Engoron asked Trump's lawyer, Christopher Kise. "This is not a political rally. This is a courtroom."

And this is the guy who a wide swath of the country wants to make president again; a dumb blowhard who can't control himself.

It would be funny if the consequences weren't so serious.

"I’m sure the judge will rule against me because he always rules against me,"

Says the 5-year old.

A crock and a whiner. How presidential.

And this is the guy who a wide swath of the country wants to make president again; a dumb blowhard who can't control himself. 

In other words, shut up and take the sham abuse? Naw, I think he should fight this injustice, I wouldn’t be quiet either. So no one was a victim, loans were all paid off early, the financial disclosures were below actual net worth, contracts drawn up by attorneys agreeing the bank is to do diligence looking for errors, the prosecution vocalized intentions to get the pale male long before there was a suspicion of fraud. Wow, most made up investigation in history.

It would be funny if the consequences weren't so serious.

They're not, it’s a civil trial.

In other words, shut up and take the sham abuse?

LoL yes, holding Trump to the same level of decorum as every other defendant is telling Trump to "shut up and take abuse." Good point. King Donald should be allowed to say whatever he wants whenever he wants, and anything short of that is unfair. :)

They're not, it’s a civil trial.

Good on you for pointing that out, I had no idea. I was actually talking about the prospect of electing this "clever" businessman to office again.

I think this case is a disgrace. Many people are leaving New York because of exactly this kind of thing,

Many working people and minorities were forced out of the city by the predatory real estate development and gentrification pushed by Fred, Donald and Trump org.

That this rhetoric has traction with a certain demographic makes one despair for humanity.

In other words, shut up and take the sham abuse? 

In other words, defend your legal position and stop acting like a spoiled little brat.

You know what kind of people act like this in court? People who don’t have a strong defense.

I wouldn’t be quiet eithe

Bravo.

Trump is grandstanding.

So no one was a victim, loans were all paid off early, the

This old chestnut? LoL Hey Bass, if someone breaks into your house and you don't notice, have they broken into your house?

financial disclosures were below actual net worth,

Only when it came to filing taxes. That's where the fraud comes in.

Sounds like the judge mostly kept quite and instead started adding zeros onto Trump's fine.

bass4funkToday 07:10 am JST

In other words, shut up and take the sham abuse?

Now you and TRump understand why court is a serious business. He will sit there and take his lumps or he will actually find out what sleeping in a jail cell is like.

Naw, I think he should fight this injustice, I wouldn’t be quiet either. 

Thought you said you would just plead out with the Fed’s gun to your head, no? Glad to see you would stand up for what you believe in instead.

bass4funk

And this is the guy who a wide swath of the country wants to make president again; a dumb blowhard who can't control himself. 

In other words, shut up and take the sham abuse? Naw, I think he should fight this injustice, I wouldn’t be quiet either.

Trump playing the victim yet again. He isn't taking sham abuse, he committed fraud. He is guilty. They are just working out the sentence. This isn't an example of injustice.

So no one was a victim, loans were all paid off early,

So if Sam Bankman Fried had been lucky and didn't lose billions of customers money, should he have been let off for committing fraud?

the financial disclosures were below actual net worth, contracts drawn up by attorneys agreeing the bank is to do diligence looking for errors,

That is a worthless clause according to contract law. It doesn't let Trump off the hook for the accounts the he signed.

the prosecution vocalized intentions to get the pale male long before there was a suspicion of fraud. Wow, most made up investigation in history.

It's not made up. Trump committed fraud. Fact.

It would be funny if the consequences weren't so serious.

They're not, it’s a civil trial.

They are. He could lose his business and the ability to conduct business in New York.

vocalized intentions to get the pale male

Did Letitia James express a racist motivation for her prosecution of Trump? That's what Trump has claimed, and so are you, but is there any evidence that she wanted to "get the pale male"?

His entire demeanor screams petulant 5 year old in need of a nap.

Never a good look in or out of the courtroom.

He’s screwed. He knows he’s screwed. He’s failing to goad the judge into giving him an appealable issue, so he’s lashing out and melting down.

LoL yes, holding Trump to the same level of decorum as every other defendant

No, not even close to being the truth.

is telling Trump to "shut up and take abuse." Good point.

Then in that the case the judge doesn’t need to whine.

King Donald should be allowed to say whatever he wants whenever he wants, and anything short of that is unfair. :)

In such a political witch hunt trial, absolutely.

Good on you for pointing that out,

Not just me.

He’s screwed. He knows he’s screwed. 

That's right. And every time this happens he goes real noisy and whiny, hoping his fan base will save him. Same as after the 2020 election.

He should have been found in contempt of court and have spent a night or two in the cells until he learned to treat the court with respect.

Actually, getting to know the inside of a cell might be worth his while given that Jack Smith has a pretty good case against him.

No, not even close to being the truth.

You're right, if anything, he's been treated with kid gloves.

Then in that the case the judge doesn’t need to whine.

The judge isn't whining. The judge is controlling their courtroom like all judges do. As the judge rightly pointed out, the court room isn't a campaign rally. If Donald isn't able to answer questions, and only the questions asked, then there should be consequences.

In such a political witch hunt trial, absolutely.

lol Yes, any attempt at hold Trump accountable is a witch hunt trial.

This is a glimpse of what will happen next November when 45 and his supporters will be stomping their widdle feet.

He knows he’s in deep trouble and is just trying to provoke Engoron into overreacting for a mistrial or to aid his appeal. Which he will lose.

It’s a strategy also meant to provoke his mindless supporters into thinking this is somehow helping them.

It’s a strategy also meant to provoke his mindless supporters into thinking this is somehow helping them.

Who specifically would a "mindless supporter" be in your opinion? A registered US voter?

Ask CNN why you're wrong:

That doesn't answer my question.

Do you think "I'm popular" is going to stop the state of New York from selling off Trump's assets? I don't. :)

Who specifically would a "mindless supporter" be in your opinion? A registered US voter?

Yes, that’s right but a small percentage of them.

Even the hack lawyers Trump hires know the basics of a trial; If you have the facts on your side, argue the facts; if you have the law on your side, argue the law; if you have neither the facts nor the law, pound the table.

It's clear by the two-year old toddler tantrums of the respondent that he has neither facts nor the law...thus the insane theatrics...

What he will have is a judgment against him in this case and multiple convictions for the 91 charges he is facing in his criminal indictments...

And a nice corner cell waiting for him at Leavenworth...

Cry-baby Trump as always.

Treated so unfairly, a witch hunt, biased judges, but how about ......

Time that he shuts up for good and gets send to where he belongs!

I'm sure the inmates will give him a warm welcome!

This civil matter could become a criminal matter if either evidence of perjury or evidence that would further the certainty of conviction.

I think it’s a pretty open and shut case of fraud and conspiracy.

But this is the end of the Potemkin Village known as the Trump “organization” (stifles a snigger).

Judge: "I don’t want to hear everything he has to say."

totally unbiased judge, huh?

the purpose of testimony is to allow the accused to speak w everything THEY think helps their defense or proves their innocence.

if you can’t be bothered to listen because you already decided guilt, don’t be a judge.

the purpose of testimony is to allow the accused to speak w everything THEY think helps their defense or proves their innocence.

lol No it's not. You don't have the right to say whatever you want. A courtroom isn't a rally stage.

Judge: "I don’t want to hear everything he has to say."

totally unbiased judge, huh?

You conveniently left off the part where the judge says he is there to hear Trump answer the questions asked, not to listen to diatribes and deflections.

I’m sure that was just an oversight, eh?

if you can’t be bothered to listen because you already decided guilt, don’t be a judge.

Right, because he already is. Trump has already been found to have commited fraud. boohoo

Jupiter acted like a big spoiled baby. Change his diaper and stuff a binky in his pie hole. His attorney's should be ashamed to show their faces in court again.

Deutsche Bank, eh? For those with a NYTs account this investigative article from 2020 is eye opening, to say the least. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/04/magazine/deutsche-bank-trump.html

He said that should not matter because the estimates included language saying they might not be accurate and his lender Deutsche Bank cared more about the amount of cash he had on hand. "I've had a lot of cash for a long time," Trump said.

Engoron is hearing evidence without a jury. The judge in September found Trump, his adult sons and 10 of his companies liable for fraud, describing in scathing terms how the defendants made up valuations.

What a great "winning" legal strategy - at your trial which is judge-only, insult the judge, say he is a hack, whine that everything is "unfair", and generally act like a two-year old...

Sure, that's "genius" and a sure way to "win" and limit your liability...

Just wait until Ivanka gets on the stand tomorrow - she will quickly go from favorite kid and date partner to someone who is shunned and disinherited...

Judge: "I don’t want to hear everything he has to say."

totally unbiased judge, huh?

It's a court room. Witnesses are there to answer the attorney's questions and nothing more.

He should have been found in contempt of court and have spent a night or two in the cells until he learned to treat the court with respect.

Yes. Had it been any other witness that is what would have happened. I know an attorney who spent three nights in jail for contempt for saying something far less disrespectful than the things Jupiter spewed in court today.

the purpose of testimony is to allow the accused to speak w everything THEY think helps their defense or proves their innocence.

Ever been in a court room? Apparently not. Witnesses do not have any right to speak freely when being cross examined by opposing counsel. You answer the questions opposing counsel asks you. Often all you are allowed is a yes or no answer. Anything else gets you chewed out by the judge. If the defense in this instance wanted their client to speak freely and at length they could have cross examined him and offered him the opportunity to do so. They did not.

You don't have the right to say whatever you want. 

you actually do. It’s your defense of accusations.

if you don’t want me testifying don’t accuse me of something in a court case.

not to listen to diatribes and deflections.

As defined by who? The biased judge and his hyper partisan law clerk?

Blacklabel

not to listen to diatribes and deflections.

As defined by who? The biased judge and his hyper partisan law clerk?

I haven't seen anything to suggest that the Trump (or the law clerk) are biased in any way.

After being sworn in, Trump testifies that he doesn't think any real estate developer ever lowballed the value of his assets more than he has, USA Today reported. Engoron quickly issues a rebuke, telling Trump not to editorialize: "Mr. Kise, can you control your client? This is not a political rally, this is a courtroom," Engoron says.

For Trump it's just another reality show - like The Apprentice...

In another clash with Trump, Engoron vents: “In addition to the answers being nonresponsive, they're repetitive," the Associated Press reported.

Stupid and ridiculous too...

While Trump downplayed his own involvement in the preparation of financial statements James says were riddled with falsehoods, he did concede he had some role. “I would look at them, I would see them, and maybe on some occasions, I would have some suggestions," he testified.

Yea, and he would sign them too - certifying that everything was factual and truthful...

Wallace asks Trump if he thinks Mar-a-Lago is worth $1.5 billion. "I think between a billion and a billion-five," Trump says of his private club and residence in Florida.

Trump replies; "That's including all the Top Secret documents in the bathroom - take those away and it's worth $30 million....

Pressed by Wallace on the wording on the Mar-a-Lago deed that states "the Club and Trump intend to forever extinguish their right to develop or use the Property for any purpose other than club use," Trump responds, "'Intend' doesn't mean we will do it."

Just like he "intended" to build the wall and have Mexico pay for it...

Wallace presses Trump on the overvaluation of his Manhattan penthouse apartment in Trump Tower, the square footage of which was listed on Trump financial forms at triple the actual size. Trump concedes: “The number was too high. They lowered it after that.”

At least he's consistent, he lied and tripled the actual size of his inauguration size too...

The fool is going to pay millions and can kiss his NY businesses goodbye...

But that's pennies compared to what he'll get at his criminal trials...for those there's a call waiting for him at Leavenworth....

Blacklabel

You don't have the right to say whatever you want. 

you actually do. It’s your defense of accusations.

No it's not. You are asked questions and you are required to answer them. You are not free to say anything other than an answer to the question. That's how courts work.

if you don’t want me testifying don’t accuse me of something in a court case.

He's free to testify, but that is restricted to answering the questions asked.

you actually do. It’s your defense of accusations.

You actually don't. When you're asked a question, you answer it.

You don't prattle on endlessly.

if you don’t want me testifying don’t accuse me of something in a court case.

lol What a thuggish response. Good thing that's not how court works.

What a joke! And the republicans want this guy to run the country?!

As defined by who? The biased judge and his hyper partisan law clerk?

It is the judges courtroom. You obey the judge

if you don’t want me testifying don’t accuse me of something in a court case.

The 5th Amendment says you cannot be compelled to testify against yourself. If you instead choose to testify in your defense then you follow the rules of testimony set fourth by the judge. A defendant defies a judge at their peril.

you actually do. It’s your defense of accusations.

if you don’t want me testifying don’t accuse me of something in a court case.

Petulant stubbornness in the face of facts, it’s a maga trait. Won’t help though.

In a separate line of questioning Monday, Trump distanced himself from a statement of financial condition from 2021, claiming he was busy at the time “keeping our country safe” from the likes of China and Russia.

“I was so busy in the White House,” Trump said. “My threshold was China, Russia and keeping our country safe.”

“Just for the record,” Wallace replied, “you weren’t president in 2021?”

“No, I wasn’t,” Trump acknowledged.

More humiliation and evidence of blatant lying - or that his mind is completely shot...

Makes one wonder if he's trying a defense of "I'm not competent to stand trial"...

The desperation to “get” Trump is more and more obvious.

But to do it have to be more and more biased and voters are noticing,

that CBS poll and then The NY Times poll was devastating.

upcoming “health issue” for Joe to be replaced?

Blacklabel

you actually do. It’s your defense of accusations.

Hummmm

Trump often avoided direct answers, instead bragging about his properties and his wealth

So you’re saying not answering questions but deflecting and bragging about wealth is his “defense of accusations”? Interesting…

Abysmal impulse control. Just what one wants in the nuclear chain of command….

A defendant defies a judge at their peril

what peril? The judge already “ruled” before the trial even started, right?

judge said he doesn’t even want to hear what Trump has to say.

biased judge gonna punish him more for standing up to the clear bias? Good ground for appeal then.

The desperation to “get” Trump is more and more obvious. 

Determination, not desperation. He is not above the law. And he’s making it easy.

The desperation to “get” Trump is more and more obvious.

However you choose to cope is all fine. Pretend it’s a witch hunt and he’s going to be President again if it makes you feel better. Then when it doesn’t happen you can pretend it was all rigged, again.

that CBS poll and then The NY Times poll was devastating.

Ergo, Trump is blameless and the judge should toss the case.

You don’t have an actual defense of your man, do you?

And he’s making it easy.

yet it’s been 7 years and nothing.

Well nothing except he will be re-elected in 12 months.

I wonder What would he “hard” then if this is easy?

Blacklabel

A defendant defies a judge at their peril

what peril? The judge already “ruled” before the trial even started, right?

The original trial to see if he is guilty has concluded, correct. He was found guilty. This trial is to determine what penalty is.

judge said he doesn’t even want to hear what Trump has to say.

Didn't need to. The facts speak for themselves.

biased judge gonna punish him more for standing up to the clear bias? Good ground for appeal

The judge isn't biased, so that's good news. No grounds for appeal.

yet it’s been 7 years and nothing.

4 indictments ain't nothing. lol

You don’t have an actual defense of your man, do you?

I do. But it’s not necessary to even talk about when the voters are already rejecting your little partisan indictments and witch hunts.

doesn’t matter what I think when the voters are showing you clearly how Americans really feel about Trump.

22% Black support now and rising. More than anyone Blacks understand unfair and biased prosecutions from two tiered justice systems.

The desperation to “get” Trump is more and more obvious.

I'd say the desperation is in the guy that "senile-slipped" and forgot he wasn't President in 2021...and thinks windmills are killing whales...

But to do it have to be more and more biased and voters are noticing,

I think they notice when someone claims you need an ID to buy bread...

that CBS poll and then The NY Times poll was devastating.

Quite the flip - this poster used to claim these were hated MSM that can never be trusted...

upcoming “health issue” for Joe to be replaced?

Much more likely an upcoming "jail issue" for the Great Orange Oracle...

I do. But it’s not necessary to even talk about when the voters are already rejecting your little partisan indictments and witch hunts.

Sorry to break it to you, but court cases are adjudicated in court, not in polls.

22% Black support now and rising. More than anyone Blacks understand unfair and biased prosecutions from two tiered justice systems.

Show me some solid evidence that Blacks are turning to Trump because they feel these prosecutions are biased.

And he’s making it easy.

yet it’s been 7 years and nothing.

The reckoning is neigh. Sit tight, sweetie. You won’t have long to wait.

biased judge gonna punish him more for standing up to the clear bias? Good ground for appeal then.

There is zero grounds for appeal. None.

I do.

Nah. No you don't. :)

Blacklabel

You don’t have an actual defense of your man, do you?

I do. But it’s not necessary to even talk about when the voters are already rejecting your little partisan indictments and witch hunts.

There aren't any partisan indictments or witch hunts. This trial is taking place because Trump committed fraud. Why don't you address the fact that Trump has been found guilty and that's why this trial is taking place.

No, but it’s clear that voters are unconcerned with your 91 charges and 4 Indictments that you are counting on to put Trump in jail or keep him off the ballot. (Your only hopes of winning outside of removing Biden immediately)

No, but it’s clear that voters are unconcerned with your 91 charges and 4 Indictments 

Um, no. It’s unconcerning to his cult.

That he’s going to be found guilty because he is so obviously guilty AF is of quite a bit of concern to everyone who is not in this cult.

No, but it’s clear that voters are unconcerned with your 91 charges and 4 Indictments that you are counting on to put Trump in jail or keep him off the ballot. (Your only hopes of winning outside of removing Biden immediately)

Is that your defense?:)

No, but it’s clear that voters are unconcerned with your 91 charges and 4 Indictments that you are counting on to put Trump in jail or keep him off the ballot. (Your only hopes of winning outside of removing Biden immediately)

Well it's nice to see we have a convert today - after years of ranting against the NY Times and the major networks as the "hated MSM" that only publishes "leftist lies and misinformation", and can never be trusted...

This poster now is a NY Times and CBS lover....thinks their recent poll is gospel and has cited it at least four times today...

That is until tomorrow - then he'll flip and be back to calling it a "leftist rag" again...

Welcome to MAGA-world...

I don't think I saw Russia mentioned once in the article.

What are they are trying to pin on him now?

Oh, yeah. The same fraud all the bigwigs are guilty of.

I would support prosecuting the living hell out of Trump if I could be assured it would cause a domino effect that took down all the other lying, corrupt bigwigs. But I know that won't happen because I know the lying, corrupt bigwigs are behind this very timely coordinated effort to take Trump down.

Well it isn't fair... Most people would already be behind bars at this point. It is unfair that Trump gets treated more favorably than most for the same offenses.

22% Black support now and rising. More than anyone Blacks understand unfair and biased prosecutions from two tiered justice systems.

Wesley Snipes already showed that. Look what happened to him.

Trump has coasted on his white silver spoon privilege since the 80's.

It's of little surprise to me that that a serial liar and lifetime conman like the NFT hawker, the Florida-male who's used the courts to bully his way through to the wealth he claims to have ammassed, is now claiming the court is corrupt because the court is using actual laws and the previous guy's not getting his way. It's not surprising at all that the Trumpderathals many petty conmen themselves, are also attacking another US system. Like their idol they have great disdain for the US partly because now and then the system's laws and regulations can limit their greed. And even expect them to pay taxes and not break laws; many in the cult would probably be much happier in Belarus.

In other words, defend your legal position and stop acting like a spoiled little brat. 

Not if the fix is in.

You know what kind of people act like this in court? People who don’t have a strong defense.

Or politically persecuted people.

Keepyer Internetpoints

I don't think I saw Russia mentioned once in the article.

What are they are trying to pin on him now?

If you haven't been following along, this investigation came from the evidence that came out of the trial of Michael Cohen. Michael Cohen did time for essentially doing Trump's dirty work.

Oh, yeah. The same fraud all the bigwigs are guilty of.

What? I don't think so. You'll have to provide some links of evidence for this one.

I would support prosecuting the living hell out of Trump if I could be assured it would cause a domino effect that took down all the other lying, corrupt bigwigs.

Don't worry, you can be assured.

But I know that won't happen because I know the lying, corrupt bigwigs are behind this very timely coordinated effort to take Trump down.

There is no coordinated effort to take Trump down. That's not a thing. But I do know that some Trump supporters can't admit that their boy did some very bad things.

Wesley Snipes already showed that. Look what happened to him. 

Snipes doesn’t have Presidential powers, kinda irrelevant to bring him up.

Trump has coasted on his white silver spoon privilege since the 80's.

He’s a businessman, what’s wrong with that?

bass4funk

You know what kind of people act like this in court? People who don’t have a strong defense.

Or politically persecuted people.

Luckily there aren't any politics in this case.

bass4funk

Trump has coasted on his white silver spoon privilege since the 80's.

He’s a businessman, what’s wrong with that?

Not for much longer in New York!

bass4funk

Wesley Snipes already showed that. Look what happened to him. 

> Snipes doesn’t have Presidential powers, kinda irrelevant to bring him up.

Nor does Trump and this case is about Trump the businessman not Trump the ex-president.

Not for much longer in New York!

That’s ok, we have 49 other states

Trump's business HQ is New York and it will be a big loss to him.